Away - 9/27 Montreal

[hatt91]

I've been disapointed in how Harrison has played centrally

I think that's just because he doesn't have the experience under Vieira's system to play that role. He's used to going wide and take on a fullback one on one. When playing Maxi's role, there's a lot more analysis and decision making to go on, in addition to the passing/shooting. I think Harrison has those tools, but he would need time to develop them.

 

[Kjbert]

very good posts by Seven and hatt91

Playing the CAM for PV is difficult. You need to be comfortable playing somewhat back to goal when you receive the ball and you need to be able to distribute it right away. Jack likes to attack immediately. Sometimes the right decision is to change fields or backpass

 

[Kangaroo Jack]

very good posts by Seven and hatt91

Playing the CAM for PV is difficult. You need to be comfortable playing somewhat back to goal when you receive the ball and you need to be able to distribute it right away. Jack likes to attack immediately. Sometimes the right decision is to change fields or backpass

Maxi is also very smart at simply knowing where to be and when to be there. Hes all over the field making an impact (pun intended).

 

[Kjbert]

Maxi is also very smart at simply knowing where to be and when to be there. Hes all over the field making an impact (pun intended).

One thing that I've noticed that separates the Villas (and in this case the Maxis) of the world is the run that makes the run. I was watching the Everton - Stoke match opening weekend. Rooney scored a header but he was only able to score because Davy Klaasen made a near post run and dragged both CBS with him. Rooney was open near the 6 when the ball was delivered. If Klaasen doesn't make the run, no goal.

Something else Jack (and others) need to learn to maximize their attacking potential.

 

[Christopher Jee]

I would post this in the Houston post-match thread but wouldn't wanna distract from the JLew guessing game for actual football.

I think that PV is trying to have us play a 4-5-1 or 4-4-2 in D which transitions to the 3-4-2-1 in attack, which is why we saw Jack and Maxi so narrow in attack. Ideally this means Jack comes inside, Ring hangs and the full backs get up the pitch very quickly. But it's a discombobulating set of transitions compared to the way a 4-3-3 transitions from D to attack (basically the wide players move forward and that's it). I think we are still getting the hang of this, which is why Houston were so effective at bunkering against us.

I may be wrong - I was pretty sloshed on Saturday and I haven't watched a replay yet.

I think it can work if:

• ... we can move the ball forward to Villa / Harrison / Maxi more quickly
• Ring can really own that front sweeper role and push Brillant and Callens wider so that
• Struna and Sweat can stay high.

I understand why people would rather see us lock down 2nd spot with the 4-3-3, but I think PV is aware of the limitations of being undermanned in midfield, especially against the 3 ATB systems of teams like RBNJ and Toronto, and is trying to get us drilled and ready to play what is essentially a 6 man midfield. It's a ballsy move this late in the season, but I think his philosophy is that if we can't win MLS Cup it doesn't matter where we finish or what round we go out in. I partially agree because I don't think that there is a ton of advantage to playing second legs at home, or even to avoiding the first round play-in.

Am I crazy?

 

[Ulrich]

I would post this in the Houston post-match thread but wouldn't wanna distract from the JLew guessing game for actual football.

I think that PV is trying to have us play a 4-5-1 or 4-4-2 in D which transitions to the 3-4-2-1 in attack, which is why we saw Jack and Maxi so narrow in attack. Ideally this means Jack comes inside, Ring hangs and the full backs get up the pitch very quickly. But it's a discombobulating set of transitions compared to the way a 4-3-3 transitions from D to attack (basically the wide players move forward and that's it). I think we are still getting the hang of this, which is why Houston were so effective at bunkering against us.

I may be wrong - I was pretty sloshed on Saturday and I haven't watched a replay yet.

I think it can work if:

• ... we can move the ball forward to Villa / Harrison / Maxi more quickly
• Ring can really own that front sweeper role and push Brillant and Callens wider so that
• Struna and Sweat can stay high.

I understand why people would rather see us lock down 2nd spot with the 4-3-3, but I think PV is aware of the limitations of being undermanned in midfield, especially against the 3 ATB systems of teams like RBNJ and Toronto, and is trying to get us drilled and ready to play what is essentially a 6 man midfield. It's a ballsy move this late in the season, but I think his philosophy is that if we can't win MLS Cup it doesn't matter where we finish or what round we go out in. I partially agree because I don't think that there is a ton of advantage to playing second legs at home, or even to avoiding the first round play-in.

Am I crazy?

Are you still sloshed?

I don't think in theory it's a bad move as preparation for Toronto et al, but doing it with TMac/Pirlo in the lineup is an exercise in futility. We will not beat in-form Toronto, Atlanta, or RB with that pair in the lineup, ever, so why practice it with them both now? PV should be trying to insert like-for-like players so that when our walking wounded return, the speed and flow of the game is similar and not stunted by those two moving in 1st gear.

 

[Christopher Jee]

Are you still sloshed?

I don't think in theory it's a bad move as preparation for Toronto et al, but doing it with TMac/Pirlo in the lineup is an exercise in futility. We will not beat in-form Toronto, Atlanta, or RB with that pair in the lineup, ever, so why practice it with them both now? PV should be trying to insert like-for-like players so that when our walking wounded return, the speed and flow of the game is similar and not stunted by those two moving in 1st gear.

So much of the football talk on here is centered on individuals in absence of any discussion about the systems in which they play. I honestly didn't see a lot wrong with how either of them played in this system, at least not more than I did with any other player.

 

[Christopher Jee]

Are you still sloshed?

I don't think in theory it's a bad move as preparation for Toronto et al, but doing it with TMac/Pirlo in the lineup is an exercise in futility. We will not beat in-form Toronto, Atlanta, or RB with that pair in the lineup, ever, so why practice it with them both now? PV should be trying to insert like-for-like players so that when our walking wounded return, the speed and flow of the game is similar and not stunted by those two moving in 1st gear.

And no, I'm sober.

 

[Ulrich]

So much of the football talk on here is centered on individuals in absence of any discussion about the systems in which they play. I honestly didn't see a lot wrong with how either of them played in this system, at least not more than I did with any other player.

My issue was the amount of walking behind the play that the two did and the constant breaking of a counter in order to get the ball to Pirlo. If we use this new formation in the playoffs, we won't ever slow the ball down as much as Saturday nor hopefully will the midfield leave so much space between the forwards and the back.

 

[Christopher Jee]

My issue was the amount of walking behind the play that the two did and the constant breaking of a counter in order to get the ball to Pirlo. If we use this new formation in the playoffs, we won't ever slow the ball down as much as Saturday nor hopefully will the midfield leave so much space between the forwards and the back.

My explanation for the faltering counters was a lack of fluidity when it comes to executing on some pretty complicated offensive transitions. I lost count of the number of times that Struna or Sweat looked for the ball forward but couldn't find a clear opportunity without forcing a less than 50-50 ball.

I also feel that as the two CDMs in that system, they need to sit pretty deep in order to allow the back 3 to cover width without leaving gaping holes.

Fuck it, I'm gonna watch the replay. Ramses on the commentary. The things I do for this team. Also 6 hours on a bus > watching a game on Unimas.

 

[Ulrich]

My explanation for the faltering counters was a lack of fluidity when it comes to executing on some pretty complicated offensive transitions. I lost count of the number of times that Struna or Sweat looked for the ball forward but couldn't find a clear opportunity without forcing a less than 50-50 ball.

I also feel that as the two CDMs in that system, they need to sit pretty deep in order to allow the back 3 to cover width without leaving gaping holes.

Fuck it, I'm gonna watch the replay. Ramses on the commentary. The things I do for this team. Also 6 hours on a bus > watching a game on Unimas.

I watched it on mute and it wasn't that bad.

 

[SoupInNYC]

My explanation for the faltering counters was a lack of fluidity when it comes to executing on some pretty complicated offensive transitions. I lost count of the number of times that Struna or Sweat looked for the ball forward but couldn't find a clear opportunity without forcing a less than 50-50 ball.

I wonder if a lot of that was playing our CAM on the wing, playing another CAM who doesn't have pace on the counter or the technical ability to receive passes in tight spaces, and playing two deep-lying midfielders in a midfield of 3.

There probably wouldn't be many options to pass to going forward.

 

[JGarrettLieb]

Were going to loose horribly off of some referee induced bullshit and it will cause either Maxi or Ring to be suspended the moment Yangel comes back.

I can't stand PRO refereeing anymore.

 

[Christopher Jee]

I wonder if a lot of that was playing our CAM on the wing, playing another CAM who doesn't have pace on the counter or the technical ability to receive passes in tight spaces, and playing two deep-lying midfielders in a midfield of 3.

There probably wouldn't be many options to pass to going forward.

If you have Villa, Harrison and Maxi presenting good long options and Struna + Sweat presenting good wide short options, it shouldn't be a problem. It's all about making the right transitions in the right phase of play. Without familiarity / chemistry, that's hard to do. Watch how Chelsea and Spurs do it.

 

[SoupInNYC]

If you have Villa, Harrison and Maxi presenting good long options and Struna + Sweat presenting good wide short options, it shouldn't be a problem. It's all about making the right transitions in the right phase of play. Without familiarity / chemistry, that's hard to do. Watch how Chelsea and Spurs do it.

I must have misinterpreted your previous post, sorry.

I thought you were talking about when Struna/Sweat had the ball and were looking to play it forward but had limited options.

 

[Christopher Jee]

I must have misinterpreted your previous post, sorry.

I thought you were talking about when Struna/Sweat had the ball and were looking to play it forward but had limited options.

Sorry, I was, but didn't know you were referencing that in particular.

 

[LionNYC]

With my new staff powers, I removed all comments regarding kneeling during the national anthem in this match thread. Let's keep the match thread about the match. Soccer and politics are not mutually exclusively, but a match thread is not the place for the discussion. Nonetheless, the discussion should be had. If one feels inclined I'd recommend Off Topic as the place for it on this forum.

http://nycfcforums.com/index.php?forums/off-topic.8/

 

[Seven]

https://twitter.com/x/status/911716253420617729

Not sure if it will affect his status for tomorrow night

 

[LionNYC]

https://twitter.com/x/status/911716253420617729

Not sure if it will affect his status for tomorrow night

Back to third place in the East, hopefully. No MVP season. And an early playoff exit.

Man, he should never have gone back to Spain.

 

[LeeNYCFC]

Back to third place in the East, hopefully. No MVP season. And an early playoff exit.

Man, he should never have gone back to Spain.

It stinks but if your team is entirely dependent on having a 36 year old 100% healthy to function offensively this is where you end up. I'd rather see him not travel and get tomorrow off at this point.